The Psycho of Sojka
Sophomore
Posts: 107
Reg: 11-15-15
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02-19-20 09:55 PM - Post#300771
In response to Old Bison
I respectively disagree. I also know what happened in this incident but, after how many dumb decisions do you finally learn. The issue with this matter is somewhat the players fault I agree but, also lack of discipline from coaches.
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raybucknell12
Freshman
Posts: 54
Reg: 02-19-12
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02-19-20 10:12 PM - Post#300775
In response to The Psycho of Sojka
100% correct. Bruce is not a kid, he just turned 22. We have all done stupid things at that age but that does not make us free from criticism. Hell, I said some idiotic stuff at 22 which was criticized (rightfully) by this board. If you want to be free from what isn’t even really criticism, you’re free to live your life as a random nobody and not a D1 athlete. Or don’t do stupid things like breaking your hand in an absolutely idiotic way. And for that matter, don’t get yourself suspended for the four biggest games of the year by breaking team rules in an idiotic way. At some point, the man has to grow up and learn.
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DrBison
Junior
Posts: 244
Age: 73
Reg: 12-22-08
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02-19-20 11:02 PM - Post#300778
In response to raybucknell12
Yes, the young man made a mistake, a bad decision and had an immature, emotional meltdown. How is that a negative reflection on the coaches? Are they supposed to control and dictate to these young men how to behave in all ways.. A team is a family. Show me a family or a program that doesn’t have problem children or players. No one is perfect, as much as we would like to think our team should be or is!
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Old Bison
Masters Student
Posts: 619
Age: 65
Reg: 07-09-17
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02-20-20 09:03 AM - Post#300791
In response to DrBison
I said I wouldn’t comment again but the insanity is amazing. First, Bruce will be 20 when he graduates in May. Second, 20 years old is the absolute definition of a kid/young adult. Other than puberty (which is biological) it is probably the most challenging period of mental/emotional & psychological development in young adulthood. As far as the contention of this somehow being a coaching issue I’m mystified. It must be nice for some of you to have progressed so perfectly through life...must have been the Bucknell education!!!
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bisonmania
Masters Student
Posts: 920
Reg: 10-26-07
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02-20-20 09:17 AM - Post#300794
In response to Old Bison
Bruce was born January 15 of 1998. By my math that makes him 22. Again this is a public forum. I am not sure why some people have to get bent out of shape. We are here discussing our concerns because we care about the state of the program! You seem to take some of this personal. I attended my first Bucknell game 43 years ago. I have seen a lot of the years not only at Bucknell. There have been occurrences over the years that I personally have not posted. I don’t like the direction that the program is headed in currently. We as fans hold the right on this forum to state our opinions.
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Old Bison
Masters Student
Posts: 619
Age: 65
Reg: 07-09-17
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02-20-20 09:58 AM - Post#300801
In response to bisonmania
I take nothing personal and I am not “bent out of shapeâ€. It’s amazing that you’re so analytical that you can ascertain another human beings emotional feelings by analyzing very matter of fact words on a page. You have absolutely no insight into “how I feel†and your response just illustrates the exact opposite...the proverbial “pot calling the kettle blackâ€. Stop with this public forum and I’m entitled to my opinion nonsense. The fact is if we win everything is hunky dory but if we lose than there are emotional tantrums and “opinions†that are in the aggregate predominantly “we stinkâ€. If you read my posts I am unsparing in speaking out and asking relevant questions. The difference is in the level of personal attacks and the requirement to ASSESS and ATTACH blame. I have no problem with opinions but I have an absolute distaste for the personalizing of the opinions. An opinion is one thing, getting your pound of salt is another. Attacking someone’s profession and livelihood is another and exposing a 22 YEAR OLDS mistake is worse. It’s immature and egregious. I’m back to where I started...grow up. How’s that for bent out of shape and personal?
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The Psycho of Sojka
Sophomore
Posts: 107
Reg: 11-15-15
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02-20-20 10:15 AM - Post#300803
In response to Old Bison
If I do recall Bruce is a father as well and the amount of issues that I recall he has had over the years is not a very good role model for young kids including his own. Dr. if you think that coaches are not responsible in leading by example then, there is way more issues then. I've been following the basketball program for years and I never recall any issues in the past with players that dealt with multiple suspensions or dumb actions. The last player outside this current team was Todd O'brian and that was stealing. All I am saying is if coaches (adults) don't lead by example and enforce team rules then it leads to a mess. Which is what we have now on our hands. I am fairly certain the coaches lost pretty much all if not all of the team. Maybe this is the reason why ND isn't a community person like Dave and Pat were.
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raybucknell12
Freshman
Posts: 54
Reg: 02-19-12
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02-20-20 10:30 AM - Post#300806
In response to Old Bison
I respectfully disagree with that logic. Yes, it is inappropriate to attack the character of coaches and players, as people, on this forum. But we aren't doing that here. We're commenting on their coaching abilities and playing abilities and anything that affects their ability to play the game at the highest level...including stupid injuries and stupid suspensions. Since some of our donation money, and certainly the money we spend on game tickets, etc., goes directly to the basketball program, it is fair to demand a little bit of accountability. Especially since this team is probably the most high-profile representative of this university (when it plays on TV in the NCAA tournament, e.g.).
If you can't stand the content of other's opinions here on this board, you're welcome to disable your account.
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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02-20-20 10:52 AM - Post#300811
In response to raybucknell12
If you can't stand the content of other's opinions here on this board, you're welcome to disable your account.
I think everyone has the right to publish their opinion, as long as it's not slanderous in some way. So far no-one has divulged what he did and I don't think any line has been crossed. But I also support Old Bison's right to his viewpoint - even if he completely disagrees with the opinions of a lot of others. His views help make this a really good board.
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DrBison
Junior
Posts: 244
Age: 73
Reg: 12-22-08
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02-20-20 11:01 AM - Post#300814
In response to raybucknell12
True, ND is not an outgoing person. That’s his personality. Does that make him a bad coach, bad role model, bad person? He leads the team to do a number of community support activities (Geisinger visits, school visits, etc.), just as prior coaches have. And he does enforce team rules. To say that these coaches don’t try to lead by example is just plain wrong. As stated, they can’t control or dictate everyone’s every action.
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raybucknell12
Freshman
Posts: 54
Reg: 02-19-12
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Holy Cross Game
02-20-20 11:18 AM - Post#300818
In response to DrBison
Zero people on this forum have said or even implied that ND is a bad person. Nor should they, since few (maybe none) of us know who he is as a person outside of his role as coach of the Bison. Let's not even let that enter into the discussion here.
Edited by RayBucknell12 on 02-20-20 11:19 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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MrPhillie
Postdoc
Posts: 2757
Loc: NE PA
Reg: 07-14-08
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02-20-20 11:26 AM - Post#300823
In response to Old Bison
Seems Old Bison created a thread in the spring asking why Bruce was suspended 4 games....a year after it happened. Seems exposing why he was suspended is making it personal on some level and the “didn’t you ever make a mistake†advice was not used in that thread. Why is it okay to ask why a player is suspended as a 20 year-old but not how a hand was broken as a 22 year old?
It really isn’t my business to know details of how/why either happened, I agree. But I can hold the opinion that they were poor choices which hurt the player and team. I can hold the opinion that to do something dumb as a senior is poor leadership. And I can wonder why these situations are occurring with recent Bucknell teams when apparently, they didn’t occur in recent past. And I can wonder if they will continue to occur in the future.
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raybucknell12
Freshman
Posts: 54
Reg: 02-19-12
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02-20-20 11:32 AM - Post#300826
In response to MrPhillie
Agree on all counts.
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The Psycho of Sojka
Sophomore
Posts: 107
Reg: 11-15-15
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02-20-20 11:50 AM - Post#300833
In response to MrPhillie
I respectfully agree with MrPhillie.
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Old Bison
Masters Student
Posts: 619
Age: 65
Reg: 07-09-17
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02-20-20 03:01 PM - Post#300863
In response to The Psycho of Sojka
I don't remember the context of why I asked that at the time but it had a basis to me when I asked it. It certainly wasn't raised in the capacity of embarrassing the kid and assigning blame and "collecting my scalp" because we were losing. I now apologize because upon reflection I shouldn't have asked it in any context. For you Mr Phillie to conflate and insinuate that an old thread in a forgotten context is somehow substantive to my argument and position here is a total low blow. Is that the same as saying "as I recall, Bruce is a father". That is absolutely disgraceful. So now you're taking another shot at a 22 year old on a personal level and applying your own value judgements to it. Let me say that I was totally unaware of this last bit of personal exposure (made anonymously under a pseudonym no less) and ask did you ever stop to consider what the kid may have went through at a personal level? Did you ever stop to consider that the kid and the mother could have decided to just terminate the pregnancy and wash their hands of any responsibility? What about that character judgement? What if that was your kid? Your values are all upside down. What business of it is yours or anyone else's on this board to expose and announce such a personal aspect of a young kids private life? Are these the type of things you and others are qualifying AS AN OPINION (for real!)OR relevant because this is a "public forum" It certainly isn't relevant to the basketball program and implying that this is a result of a lack of coaching discipline is beyond any common sense and another aspect of what I am addressing here. Leave the personal aspects of the kids lives out of this forum. Lastly, instead of my disabling my account why don't we all just agree to sign in tomorrow at the same time with our real identity. I dying to know who some of you #%$@ are.
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Old Bison
Masters Student
Posts: 619
Age: 65
Reg: 07-09-17
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02-20-20 03:04 PM - Post#300864
In response to Old Bison
BTW - I fully understand the father comment came from "psycho"
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Old Bison
Masters Student
Posts: 619
Age: 65
Reg: 07-09-17
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02-20-20 04:13 PM - Post#300874
In response to Old Bison
Btw Mr Phillie, I just went back and actually looked at my post under that thread. As I suspected, it was even a bigger low blow than I thought. If you go into the topic it was about kids at Michigan State and Va Tech not missing ONE game for being arrested for marijuana possession. Therefore, if you read my post I was asking why is Bucknell the only place where a kid breaks team rules and misses the league tourney and every kids lifelong dream of playing in the NCAA. You guys are implying that ND is soft and not impressing discipline on team members when my post is why our kids miss 4 games for rules violations while kids at Va Tech and MSU get arrested and don’t miss a game. Your post actually undermines your own argument because I now know exactly what the context was...and what clearly it wasn’t about - I.e., embarrassing Bruce. I was in fact supporting Bruce as my point was that unless he did something really egregious the discipline appeared to me to be heavy handed.
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raybucknell12
Freshman
Posts: 54
Reg: 02-19-12
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02-20-20 04:57 PM - Post#300877
In response to Old Bison
"Leave the personal aspects of the kids lives out of this forum." says the guy who, as far as I'm aware, is the only person in the history of this board who asked about a personal aspect of a kid's life.
If you're so interested in all of us using our real names, why do you lead by example and change your display name to your real name?
What's the phrase..."as I say, not as I do"....
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MrPhillie
Postdoc
Posts: 2757
Loc: NE PA
Reg: 07-14-08
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02-20-20 05:02 PM - Post#300878
In response to Old Bison
I did read your post and while you are talking a lot about other schools, you also clearly ask the question, “Did we ever figure out what Bruce was suspended for?†“Did he break curfew? Was he late to practice or a team meeting....what???? 4 games out against the likes of MSU and Tom Izzo. Do you guys still believe the US Govt would never lie to you?â€
What does it matter to your argument what Bruce was suspended for? Why ask? Were they rhetorical questions or did you really want to know? You could have simply stated that Bucknell had information and used their judgement in a different way than those other schools.
I don’t even care as it matters not to me. I was simply saying that even you posed questions about specific details regarding a player in that case, which is what you are saying people should not do in this case. I do not come to this board to argue or to take shots at players’ personal decisions and choices in life, and I’m not saying you do. I may criticize some basketball plays or some behaviors on court or in huddles I do not agree with. Sometimes people here talk in negative terms about where recruits end up playing if it is not Bucknell; some criticized and made snide comments about where Show and even Sestina transferred to...to me those are more personal. People have made rude comments about players’ weight. That’s personal.
In the end it isn’t my business as to what a player did to get suspended or break his hand. I think it is relevant to ask questions about culture on the team when these kinds of events just never happened under previous coaching staffs, and that fits with a season where some players may have regressed, the team hasn’t improved, and body language appears negative both with players and staff. Maybe I just miss seeing quality basketball.
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HuskyColonial
PhD Student
Posts: 1976
Age: 50
Reg: 02-17-12
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02-20-20 10:22 PM - Post#300900
In response to MrPhillie
Gentlemen this is very weird. It’s a sports board. Bucknell sports.
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